Health Care..what do you think? - Page 15

Papa_Complex · 12-09-2009, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smittie61984

So if you don't pay anything then who pays for it? And don't give me that "higher taxes" crap. Even with higher taxes I doubt you ever put in enough to pay for a Life Flight, hip replacement, or to pay for the Trauma team to save your ass post motorcycle accident.

The truth is you are STEALING money from other people to pay for your problems.

The truth is that everyone pays less for their health care, because it's dealt with through fewer layers of bureaucracy and "bought in bulk." That includes the racers who occasionally have to be helicoptered out after a crash on the track.

Smittie61984 · 12-09-2009, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa_Complex

The truth is that everyone pays less for their health care, because it's dealt with through fewer layers of bureaucracy and "bought in bulk." That includes the racers who occasionally have to be helicoptered out after a crash on the track.

Less bureaucracy with government???

Even with the "Bulk Discount" I doubt many people pay enough in taxes to have fully paid for their medical costs. Or basically if you pay $10000 in taxes directed at healthcare over say 10 years and you then have $100,000 in hospital costs. Then that $90,000 comes from someone else who was FORCED to pay for your costs.

Wether the socialist system will allow us to live and fuck for another 200years for cheaper is not the point. The point is someone is having the government take money from someone else to pay for your problem(s).

I'm not paying higher taxes to pay for some fat ass who smokes, drinks, does drugs, and only gets up to change football games because their remote control broke's hospital bills. I'd rather them die for their shitty life decisions.

Again, it is a moral issue.

Papa_Complex · 12-09-2009, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Smittie61984

Less bureaucracy with government???

Even with the "Bulk Discount" I doubt many people pay enough in taxes to have fully paid for their medical costs. Or basically if you pay $10000 in taxes directed at healthcare over say 10 years and you then have $100,000 in hospital costs. Then that $90,000 comes from someone else who was FORCED to pay for your costs.

Wether the socialist system will allow us to live and fuck for another 200years for cheaper is not the point. The point is someone is having the government take money from someone else to pay for your problem(s).

I'm not paying higher taxes to pay for some fat ass who smokes, drinks, does drugs, and only gets up to change football games because their remote control broke's hospital bills. I'd rather them die for their shitty life decisions.

Again, it is a moral issue.

Yes, it's a moral issue: Are you the sort of person who would help your neighbour, or aren't you?

The studies that have been put forward indicate that a great deal of the cost difference between our two systems is the multiple levels of bureaucracy in your system, from the doctor, to the hospital, to the HMO, to the insurer...... Our "single payer" system eliminates much of that.

sherri_chickie · 12-09-2009, 06:20 PM

In our system the only people out to make a profit at the doctors, who deserve to be compensated for their skill and years of education. We don't have a big burocracy trying to fill their pockets.

How is healthcare different that house or car insurance? You still pay car insurance and house insurance, Do you think that you will pay enough to pay for your house if it were to burn down and you filed a claim? To me it looks no different that what you say we do when we " STEAL" from others forced to pay for our treatment.

"Same Same."

I dont't think anyone is saying that the U.S system should be the same as ours, each country had to do what is right for it. We have different mind sets, Canadians don't mind that we may be covering for others because others may have to cover for us.

The money for healthcare doesn't just come from personal income taxes either, corporations pay their taxes, $$ get pooled, and budgeted out accordingly.

Tsunami · 12-09-2009, 06:25 PM

How do Canadian doctors get paid, is it just one flat salary or do they get paid per patient?

goof2 · 12-09-2009, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa_Complex

Yes, it's a moral issue: Are you the sort of person who would help your neighbour, or aren't you?

There is a difference between voluntarily helping your neighbor and forcing everyone to help that neighbor under penalty of law.

Papa_Complex · 12-09-2009, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tsunami

How do Canadian doctors get paid, is it just one flat salary or do they get paid per patient?

Depends.

Papa_Complex · 12-09-2009, 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goof2

There is a difference between voluntarily helping your neighbor and forcing everyone to help that neighbor under penalty of law.

Yes, there is a difference. As a society we recognize the value of doing so.

goof2 · 12-09-2009, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Papa_Complex

Yes, there is a difference. As a society we recognize the value of doing so.

That is wonderful for YOUR society. Some people in THIS country who would voluntarily help their neighbor aren't interested in being legally bound to help complete strangers anymore than they already are. Considering the state of the public option in the Senate bill, that would appear to be true for close to a majority of Senators as well.

was92v · 12-09-2009, 08:24 PM

I have insurance through work that I pay for, as well as ST disability, LT disability, dental and vision that I pay extra for. I don't see a doctor often, in fact it has been years since I've seen one.
Today I watched the PP presentation for the 2010 changes. Woo Hoo the rates aren't going up as much as they had in the past! Oh! but my deductible is going to be $5,000.00 individual or $10,000.00 per year for family coverage. But that is just 25% of take home and my taxes are cheap, only 20%. Good thing we don't have state income or local taxes, well except for that 9.75% sales tax thing.
I just wish that I hadn't noticed that 4 or5 people at work this past year were fired 6 weeks after coming back from serious medical events. But I guess ya gotta do something to keep the insurance rates down, even if it means putting them in the unemployment line. I sure hope I don't get sick. Big bills and then no job would really be stressful at my age. But I'm old, it probably wouldn't bother you young guys.

12-09-2009, 06:20 PM	#144
sherri_chickie WERA Yellow Plate Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Calgary Moto: Gs500F Posts: 683	In our system the only people out to make a profit at the doctors, who deserve to be compensated for their skill and years of education. We don't have a big burocracy trying to fill their pockets. How is healthcare different that house or car insurance? You still pay car insurance and house insurance, Do you think that you will pay enough to pay for your house if it were to burn down and you filed a claim? To me it looks no different that what you say we do when we " STEAL" from others forced to pay for our treatment. "Same Same." I dont't think anyone is saying that the U.S system should be the same as ours, each country had to do what is right for it. We have different mind sets, Canadians don't mind that we may be covering for others because others may have to cover for us. The money for healthcare doesn't just come from personal income taxes either, corporations pay their taxes, $$ get pooled, and budgeted out accordingly.

12-09-2009, 06:25 PM	#145
Tsunami Pug Queen Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Las Vegas, NV Moto: DR200, SV650 Posts: 2,486	How do Canadian doctors get paid, is it just one flat salary or do they get paid per patient?

12-09-2009, 08:24 PM	#150
was92v Nowhere Man Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 558	I have insurance through work that I pay for, as well as ST disability, LT disability, dental and vision that I pay extra for. I don't see a doctor often, in fact it has been years since I've seen one. Today I watched the PP presentation for the 2010 changes. Woo Hoo the rates aren't going up as much as they had in the past! Oh! but my deductible is going to be $5,000.00 individual or $10,000.00 per year for family coverage. But that is just 25% of take home and my taxes are cheap, only 20%. Good thing we don't have state income or local taxes, well except for that 9.75% sales tax thing. I just wish that I hadn't noticed that 4 or5 people at work this past year were fired 6 weeks after coming back from serious medical events. But I guess ya gotta do something to keep the insurance rates down, even if it means putting them in the unemployment line. I sure hope I don't get sick. Big bills and then no job would really be stressful at my age. But I'm old, it probably wouldn't bother you young guys.