Health Care..what do you think?

[karl_1052]

Originally Posted by TIGGER

Hello CANADA!!! There are these little items called question marks, they denote when the writer is asking a question. I could have sworn that you Canucks have them too... oh FUCK, I see what I did wrong. Let me try again.


''If you had your surgery here, would you have gotten the infection, EH? In other words, is Canadian health care inferior because all of the practitioners get paid less and the best/brightest choose other fields where the salary potential is better, EH?

I don't think they say "eh" out east, it is mainly an Ottawa valley thing.

[karl_1052]

Originally Posted by RACER X

does canada have the "illegals" problem like we have? and do their illegals pay taxes?

There are no illegals in Canada. Everybody is welcome, but it is too cold for Mexicans.

Originally Posted by tommymac

there are pros and cons with each system.

This is the only true statement in this whole thread.

[goof2]

Originally Posted by Tmall

Yet, ppl are scared of change.

Azoom says she doesn't want to pay for other, but again you're already paying for those who can't afford it.


What exactly are you guys opposed to with the new system?

Everything I've read just seems to be the same talking points.

We currently pay for the emergency life saving care of those who cannot afford it. Under this bill we will be paying for all care for those who cannot afford it. Can you see where there might be a difference in those two numbers?

I am not opposed to change if it is likely to work. I don't think this bill falls in that category. More than anything I am concerned that an unintended consequence will be a serious decline in medical innovations coming out of this country. That shouldn't just concern America, but the rest of the world as well.

[tommymac]

Originally Posted by goof2

We currently pay for the emergency life saving care of those who cannot afford it. Under this bill we will be paying for all care for those who cannot afford it. Can you see where there might be a difference in those two numbers?

I am not opposed to change if it is likely to work. I don't think this bill falls in that category. More than anything I am concerned that an unintended consequence will be a serious decline in medical innovations coming out of this country. That shouldn't just concern America, but the rest of the world as well.

I am not sure if its we, directly or indirectly with emergency care. I know for alot of the illegals and uninsured they just dotn pay the bills so I dont know if the hospital eats the cost or its spread out to the rest of us.

Where i work you sort of need insurance but at kings county hospital across the street you dont, the city/hhc foots the bill for all of them.

[goof2]

Originally Posted by tommymac

I am not sure if its we, directly or indirectly with emergency care. I know for alot of the illegals and uninsured they just dotn pay the bills so I dont know if the hospital eats the cost or its spread out to the rest of us.

Where i work you sort of need insurance but at kings county hospital across the street you dont, the city/hhc foots the bill for all of them.

Those who pay their medical bills pay for it. Find out how much King's County bills patients for syringes, band-aids, etc. I will bet the numbers are outrageous compared to their costs. From what I have seen patients without insurance are billed around double compared to what insurance actually pays. These are the typical ways to make up for those that don't pay their bill from what I understand.

[tommymac]

Originally Posted by goof2

Those who pay their medical bills pay for it. Find out how much King's County bills patients for syringes, band-aids, etc. I will bet the numbers are outrageous compared to their costs. From what I have seen patients without insurance are billed around double compared to what insurance actually pays. These are the typical ways to make up for those that don't pay their bill from what I understand.

I think they also overbill figuring they will at least get something back opposed to nothing.

When I was still at ups I had passed out from heat exhaustion in the warehouse and gottaken to the hospital. The money hungry quacks let me rest, checked my blood and gave me some IV saline. All in all no biggie, apparently the work ins kinda screwed up and within a month I had a collection agency harassing me. I wound up paying out of pocket then got reimbursed. HR guy got an earful from me as well as management for that one.

Tom

[goof2]

Originally Posted by tommymac

I think they also overbill figuring they will at least get something back opposed to nothing.

When I was still at ups I had passed out from heat exhaustion in the warehouse and gottaken to the hospital. The money hungry quacks let me rest, checked my blood and gave me some IV saline. All in all no biggie, apparently the work ins kinda screwed up and within a month I had a collection agency harassing me. I wound up paying out of pocket then got reimbursed. HR guy got an earful from me as well as management for that one.

Tom

I'm guessing the bill was a hell of a lot more than what you thought it should have been. This is how the system is currently set up to work. Those who do pay end up paying out the nose to make up for the people who tell the collection agency to go screw.

[101lifts2]

Originally Posted by Apoc

if you fuckin' say so man...

You do realize that survival rates across the board are no better down there, than up here right?

Its funny how 50+% of Americans think your system is shit, and less than 5% of Canadians think ours is shit. Yet yours is better, because you guys are too blind to see past the end of your noses.

Our system is EXCELLENT! It has problems, but so do yours.

Show me evidence of the failures of our system, not just hearsay bullshit, and then you can have an opinion on how it works. But we've had tons of these threads here and on cf, and it boils down to one thing, when it comes to our system, you guys dont know what the fuck your talking about.

'Its socialized, its the devil!'

Dude the person with the better insurance plan will get better care. In Canada, if it is all the same, you can only expect standardized care since everyone in the country is in the pool. In the U.S a cash paying or a good PPO insurance customer can go to any doctor and usually have any surgery in a MAX of a few weeks or immediately if life threathening. It is simply all about money. If there is a waiting list in Canada for a hip replacement, can you pay a doctor out of pocket to do the surgery? Or does one go to the U.S.?

I just got full blood tests done (I do this every 6 months) because I tell my doctor I want them. I don't need a reason. I have a PPO insurance plan with a 300 deductable per year with a 10% charge for each visit. You want good care with limited waiting? You need to pay for it. It is not very hard.

The 50% of Americans that think it's shit are the same 50% that do not pay any Federal Income taxes. The other 50% (like me) think the system is great. So...why should I be for a nationalized health care plan when the same non-paying 50% will still pay nothing BUT I will end up paying more? Many of these people are illegal Mexicans or entitlement people who don't give a fuck about their health anyways.

[Smittie61984]

Originally Posted by tommymac

I am not sure if its we, directly or indirectly with emergency care. I know for alot of the illegals and uninsured they just dotn pay the bills so I dont know if the hospital eats the cost or its spread out to the rest of us.

Where i work you sort of need insurance but at kings county hospital across the street you dont, the city/hhc foots the bill for all of them.

I'm guessing on the uninsured/illegals who visit the emergency room for a life threatning emergency, the hospital or an insurance company of the hospital eats the cost. The states may also pay the cost being the hospital is forced to treat those in an Emergency situation so to possibly justify what is essentially forced labor they pay the hospitals for it if the person bails on the bills.

And if you visit an ER (with insurance or not) for something minor like an ear infection (like I did on Halloween night) they take your drivers license and information. If they take you then I assume that they will try to get money from you like any loan place would and that is to harrass you for it. If an illegal alien or uninsured person visits the ER for something non-life threatning then I'd think they'd be turned away unless the hospital is willing to take the chance of the people actually paying. If so then that should be up to the hospital to cover for taking the risk.

[tommymac]

Originally Posted by Smittie61984

I'm guessing on the uninsured/illegals who visit the emergency room for a life threatning emergency, the hospital or an insurance company of the hospital eats the cost. The states may also pay the cost being the hospital is forced to treat those in an Emergency situation so to possibly justify what is essentially forced labor they pay the hospitals for it if the person bails on the bills.

And if you visit an ER (with insurance or not) for something minor like an ear infection (like I did on Halloween night) they take your drivers license and information. If they take you then I assume that they will try to get money from you like any loan place would and that is to harrass you for it. If an illegal alien or uninsured person visits the ER for something non-life threatning then I'd think they'd be turned away unless the hospital is willing to take the chance of the people actually paying. If so then that should be up to the hospital to cover for taking the risk.

Thats a huge no no, we are not allowed to turn anyone away, although some are discouraged from actualy making it an official visit.

The Er is a double edged sword as far as making money. The Er itself usualy costs the hospital money when a lot of stuff is done and they dont get paid.

But in our case we have helped build up the hospital as a whole by funneling a lot of these patients into various clinics for whatever their problems are.

Also a lo tof the Er journals are talking about different ways to help quell the overcrowding and long wait times by trying to get rid of the people who are there withthe sniffles or other non emergent stuff. Big problem is the leagality of all of it and a lot of CYA if you send someone away and something goes south.

Tom