less respect now days for po po?

[Trip]

Originally Posted by Quick281

I don't see anything wrong with cops writing tickets. They need the funding and to be quite honest I haven't ever received a ticket that I didn't earn. If they stopped writing tickets and their funding was increased via taxing then everyone would complain that they aren't getting enough out of their tax dollars.

It should also be noted that traffic stops frequently lead to arrests for many other things beyond speeding. Things like drug busts, DUIs and previous warrants for someones arrest wouldn't ever occur if cops didn't get out in the world and issue citations.

I befriended a couple of cops in college through a Mustang club and I couldn't believe the shit they have to deal with at times. If a cop asks you to stop and talk to him but you decide to run for it. I don't mind watching you get your ass kicked at the end of the chase.

Ticketing needs to be done with some compassion and logic. If you see someone going 15-25 mph over the limit in a place where that is easily achievable and they aren't driving like a maniac, let em be or give em a warning/tell them to slow it up. Sure some fool who is doing insane speeds for the road and weaving in and out of traffic and is most likely to cause an accident needs a ticket. Using it as a way to make money is stupid. I don't mind paying more taxes for cops and teachers, but I know if they raise taxes, it's still not going to go to these people. It goes to pork programs for whatever party is in charge...

Yes, they should be out in the world issuing citations, but they should be on the lookout for dangerous people and not trying to make a quota so they get paid that month. Better funded and run police operate in this manner, the bad ones usually don't. I know some local guys and they get paid pretty well and don't have quotas. They barely write tickets for speeding unless it is well deserved, this small community respects and thanks these officers for the way they do business and the town is better for it.

Every ticket I have gotten in my car has been 15 or under and I wasn't really doing much of anything to deserve it other than speeding. I got snagged by a speed trap. Did I deserve it for speeding, yes, I broke the law. This still pisses people off and makes them lose respect with the general public.

[Ineffable]

Originally Posted by Trip

Yes, they should be out in the world issuing citations, but they should be on the lookout for dangerous people and not trying to make a quota so they get paid that month.

I am witch Quick281 on the citation issue. I don't know the exact statistic but a VERY large percentage of arrests for outstanding warrants, drug busts etc come from simple traffic violations like speeding a few miles over the speed limit, or a broken tail light. As far as being 'on the lookout for dangerous people' this quickly becomes profiling. In a perfect world the dangerous people would be walking down the road with an ax and a big sign saying "I'm a bad guy" but this isn't the case.

It is curious that no one has mentioned the danger factor for officers so far. I know a very good amount of officers due to my mother working at the courthouse since before I was born, several uniformed family members, and through shady connections from when I was younger. They have to put up with a tremendous amount of BS on a day to day basis granted but from speaking with them the reason why they aren't all holly jolly is because in today's society they have to approach everyone as if they are about to pull a gun just to protect themselves.

I have only had a problem with 2 officers in my entire life, the rest have always been as cordial as I can expect them to be and then some. 99/100 times when a situation is 'escalated' it is usually due primarily to something the civ did. Think of it this way, as a cop when an altercation arises your job just became 100% worse due to the increased chance of violence, more paperwork, and general uncooperative attitudes so they do their best most of the time to keep the situation professional and quick.

P.S. I find the corruption excuse lame at best. Yes, there are officers in the world who are dirty, assholes, power trippers etc. but judging the character of all based on the actions of a few is a very narrow minded thing to do.

[Quick281]

The point of a speed trap is to trap speeders and remind people to slow down. Traffic always slows down when they see a cop and then speeds right up after he is gone. In any of the tickets you have ever been written did you start slowing down in that area after that experience? If yes, then the speed trap did its job of enforcing a law and keeping people "safer". If no, then you help create a reason for another speed trap in the future.

I am pretty sure that all of us as motorcyclists agree that 9 out of 10 people are crazy drivers. We also tend to agree 99 out of 100 people are complete idiots. With those two things on the table, we can see that their job isn't exactly a desirable one and it certainly isn't easy.

When some crazy bitch on her cell phone almost runs you over via a blind lane change you want a cop to be there and do something about it but almost killing you isn't breaking the law. But when you are going over the speed limit you want the cop to be out stopping bad guys. When your house is being broken into, you want the cops to come running in right away. When a cop is on his way to a call but he can't pull over the person he witnessed tail gating another driver, someone else gets mad that he isn't doing his job.

A cop cannot ever please the general public.

Cops can't just go out and find crime, this would lead to 230498723198 trillion discrimination cases. They have to respond to calls from concerned citizens unless they are out and about seeing things happen first hand. Beyond responding to calls they have to get out there and be involved with the community. In most big places that means writing tickets and investigating suspicious things.

Maybe your small town has nice and friendly officers that don't write tickets and are always nice to people but does that mean they are doing anything better? As citizens everyone is happy they aren't getting tickets but that doesn't mean they are doing anything more then the forces that are writing hundreds of citations a day in a much bigger city with all sorts of violence. Whether people believe in a quota or not doesn't matter, don't be the one who deserves the ticket.

The main point is that a large percentage of arrests and busts are through things such as traffic stops. If you are going 15 to 25 miles an hour over the speed limit whether it is out in open country or in a school zone, you are breaking the law. The discretion of letting you go or writing you a citation is up to officer. In such a case then people should be allowed to drink and drive out in open country areas where there is more space to swerve and fewer people to hit. Laws can't have flexibility like that, it is the officer's job as a logical human to use their discretion. Obviously the flaw in that system is often the human.

I have had amazingly good luck and a couple times with officers and also a couple times where I have been written up for ridiculous things. I don't hate them and there is no way in hell I could do their jobs. When I get pulled over I turned my dome light on, turn my car and stereo off, hands on the steering wheel and I don't reach for a thing unless I am asked to. I give into them like some of them expect me to and sure enough I have gotten away with a lot more than I should have.

You can't ask cops to put their lives on the line and pay them mediocre wages all while asking them to be polite and compassionate when they write you a ticket while 9 out of the 10 tickets they wrote were to people who swore up and down they didn't break a law and that the cop is an asshole.

I am not saying that people don't have terrible experiences or become victims of injustice, but rather that things are done in a somewhat logical way whether we agree with it or not.

[CrazyKell]

Originally Posted by Quick281

You can't ask cops to put their lives on the line and pay them mediocre wages ...

This is an entirely different debate as our society does not place value on professions that are admirable and for the mutual benefit of members of society. Think social workers, police officers, fire fighters, teachers, etc. etc. etc.

[Rider]

Originally Posted by Cutty72

If kids don't respect their parents authority, why the hell would they respect some jackass in a goofy uniform trying to get them in more trouble?

They will keep that mentality as they grow up, and it will get passed on to their kids.

Everyone thinks the are too fucking privelaged these days.

Ok fine, I don't give a shit WHO gives the beat down, as long as someone does.

[Trip]

Originally Posted by Quick281

A cop cannot ever please the general public.

Cops can't just go out and find crime, this would lead to 230498723198 trillion discrimination cases. They have to respond to calls from concerned citizens unless they are out and about seeing things happen first hand. Beyond responding to calls they have to get out there and be involved with the community. In most big places that means writing tickets and investigating suspicious things.

The main point is that a large percentage of arrests and busts are through things such as traffic stops. If you are going 15 to 25 miles an hour over the speed limit whether it is out in open country or in a school zone, you are breaking the law. The discretion of letting you go or writing you a citation is up to officer. In such a case then people should be allowed to drink and drive out in open country areas where there is more space to swerve and fewer people to hit. Laws can't have flexibility like that, it is the officer's job as a logical human to use their discretion. Obviously the flaw in that system is often the human.

This thread is about why there is less respect, this is why the public doesn't respect the cops. No matter how you feel what is the way to go about things, these things make us public lose respect for our law enforcement and don't really want to pay them more or treat them any better.

Actually the law is flexible and can be easily changed. As a matter of fact they lower speed limits and don't take into account engineering evaluations of what the speed limit should be in certain areas. Most "speed limits" are a fictional number given to a road based on what that government (depending on city/county/state roads) feels like giving the road. Hell they lowered speeds on some of our roads for "environmental" reasons and increased the fuckload out of their ticket writing because the road should be nowhere near that limit. Sorry you can try to make excuses why it's fine, but it still will piss off the public and make the cops job that much harder because we just see them as money making schemes.

[Ineffable]

Originally Posted by Trip

Most "speed limits" are a fictional number given to a road based on what that government (depending on city/county/state roads) feels like giving the road.

If I remember correctly most of our speed limits are actually remnants of efforts by the government to save gas back during the gas embargo in 73-74. But you are correct in saying that speed limits today don't truly reflect the 'potential' for a road. But I digress...

[Rider]

We have a lot of 55mph streets here. I'm not talking major routes, I'm talking 2 lane streets with house on both sides. So doing 60-65 on surface streets here is the norm.

[Trip]

Originally Posted by Ineffable

If I remember correctly most of our speed limits are actually remnants of efforts by the government to save gas back during the gas embargo in 73-74. But you are correct in saying that speed limits today don't truly reflect the 'potential' for a road. But I digress...

Yeah, roads are suppose to be given speed limits based on an engineers evaluation of the road. Just like yellow lights are suppose to be a certain time period long, but they break that law and shorten it to collect red light camera tickets.

I have seen the speed limit on the interstate that runs past my house change 3-4 times in the past few years. It has ranged from 75-65. Cars haven't changed all that much in the 15 years I have been driving to warrant this... Right now it's 65 because the 18 wheelers cause too much damage to the Smoky Mountains. This is a rural county and does not border the park. It literally goes from 70 to 65 when you leave the county to the south of mine to mine and then goes back up to 70 when you go to the much more populated Knox County, where Knoxville is located. It's retarded...

[101lifts2]

Respect is earned, not given.