After 107 years in Milwaukee, Harley could leave - Page 5

Adeptus_Minor · 08-05-2010, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Homeslice

That city would be destroyed if HD leaves. They've already got gangs of bored white kids roaming the streets looking for homeless people to beat up.

Wow.. they should start contracting them out to cities with too many homeless.
There's some potential revenue to be had!

Dave · 08-05-2010, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adeptus_Minor

Wow.. they should start contracting them out to cities with too many homeless.
There's some potential revenue to be had!

Bonus! They already look like hd owners

Homeslice · 08-05-2010, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dave

Bonus! They already look like hd owners

Especially with wearing beanies even when it's 80 degrees out:

a) to hide the bad hair
b) to hide the balding pattern
c) to look bad-ass or like a "working man" (when they're really a lawyer)

Dave · 08-05-2010, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Homeslice

Especially with wearing beanies even when it's 80 degrees out:

a) to hide the bad hair
b) to hide the balding pattern
c) to look bad-ass or like a "working man" (when they're really a lawyer)

I'm still trying to figure out how giant beer guts and horrendous tats got labeled badass

Kaneman · 08-05-2010, 04:51 PM

Harley Davidson Considering Assembly Plant in India

by Paul Crowe - "The Kneeslider" on 7/23/2010

in Motorcycle Business

Harley Davidson is beginning the next logical step in the international motorcycle market place, announcing they're considering an assembly plant in India. Ever since they first began talking about sales in India, this was, to my mind, a foregone conclusion since tariffs in India double the price of imported bikes. Selling in India means making them there.

The company would consider taking that step as Indian sales increase, said Rod Copes, Harley-Davidson's senior vice president of international sales, marketing and business development.

Harley also would consider manufacturing motorcycles in other countries for those markets, a step beyond assembling imported parts into completed bikes.

... "Getting the tariff reduced would be ideal. But we have not seen action on that yet," Copes said.

With 32 percent of Harley's sales outside of the U.S., figuring out how to best get a firm foothold in other countries will be an ongoing process.

I hope their experience doesn't parallel Royal Enfield. They began assembling motorcycles in India back in the mid 1950s, then making parts, then the entire bike. Finally, the British company went under and India is now the only place Royal Enfields are still manufactured.

International sales are an important component of any company's long term growth and right now, international sales are rising. If you have to build there to sell there, then you build there.

The intention is, as quoted above, "manufacturing motorcycles in other countries for those markets." Will motorcycles built there ever be sent back to the U.S.? It's very common in the auto industry and to think no one inside the Motor Company has ever asked that question or considered it for sometime in the future would be naieve.

Harley's strong identity and carefully crafted image as an American motorcycle company, generates some sales on that fact alone for a segment of their market. If you begin building motorcycles in other countries, those sales are put in jeopardy and you now become just another motorcycle company, competing with every other company out there. Then the questions become, "What makes a Harley Davidson better or unique?" Is it style? Quality? Performance? There's no right or wrong here but you can't lean on the American image and build everywhere else. All of the other companies are building in multiple locations and bikes are compared straight up. A Honda isn't given points as a Japanese bike since they are built in other places. Triumph isn't British, either, it's Triumph, for the same reasons. When Harley begins to sever the American manufacturing ties, they enter a new world, and it may be inevitable. How it works for them will be interesting to watch.

One further thought: I left out "lifestyle" as what might make Harley unique. Will that translate worldwide when the bikes are built worldwide? Does the lifestyle require a Harley? Things to think about that make you go hmm ...

wildchild · 08-05-2010, 05:08 PM

actually an interesting thought occurred to me. if HD builds outside of USA and sells here, we all agree their sales in America will basically dry up. so what would happen to sales of Japanese copies of HD. I truly think those would go away as well.
most of HD's sales go to people who don't really ride. they enjoy the "image" of a Harley. Yes most of us here with HDs ride them. that's why we are on a motorcycle site to start with. we like to ride. the sales of Japanese cruisers go to guys who want to look like Harley guys without dropping the coin. So would anyone want to ride Japanese cruisers if they weren't trying to look like HD's? I had a Shadow for a year. I wouldn't buy another one for anything. The HD I have now is a much better bike then that.
If I weren't on the HD right now I would either be back on a SS or try a BMW for a change. Guzzi is looking interesting as well.

wildchild · 08-05-2010, 05:09 PM

BTW here's a newsflash for you, for the last 30 years or so all companies have been going to more automation and less people. it's a growing trend.

Dave · 08-05-2010, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildchild

actually an interesting thought occurred to me. if HD builds outside of USA and sells here, we all agree their sales in America will basically dry up. so what would happen to sales of Japanese copies of HD. I truly think those would go away as well.
most of HD's sales go to people who don't really ride. they enjoy the "image" of a Harley. Yes most of us here with HDs ride them. that's why we are on a motorcycle site to start with. we like to ride. the sales of Japanese cruisers go to guys who want to look like Harley guys without dropping the coin. So would anyone want to ride Japanese cruisers if they weren't trying to look like HD's? I had a Shadow for a year. I wouldn't buy another one for anything. The HD I have now is a much better bike then that.
If I weren't on the HD right now I would either be back on a SS or try a BMW for a change. Guzzi is looking interesting as well.

If I was looking for a standard a guzzi or sportclassic would be very tempting

KSGregman · 08-05-2010, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wildchild

the sales of Japanese cruisers go to guys who want to look like Harley guys without dropping the coin. So would anyone want to ride Japanese cruisers if they weren't trying to look like HD's?

I can't speak for everyone who rides a metric cruiser or power cruiser...but for myself, this is a laughable load of shit.

When I buy a motorcycle, I try to obtain the maximum amount of power, performance and style (for lack of a better word) available at a price I'm willing to pay.

Currently I ride a 2007 Suzuki M109-R. It has more power, more performance and better style (subjective, I know) than anything HD offers (other than the Nightrod which is probably on fairly even footing) and for about half the price.

Harley guys seem to hold on to the higher price point as a shield to fend off the inevitable "Uh...dude....that bike MIGHT make 80-90 HP....and it's like 100 pounds overweight" comments. I see it time after time at the Cassoday rally....the Harley goes on the dyno...and the owner slinks off in embarrassment when they give the horsepower and torque output over the PA.

In my opinion, a more appropriate question might be why would anyone ride a HD knowing there are far more capable motorcycles available at much more attractive prices....other than maybe they care less about "riding" and more about "posing?"

wildchild · 08-05-2010, 05:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KSGregman

I can't speak for everyone who rides a metric cruiser or power cruiser...but for myself, this is a laughable load of shit.

When I buy a motorcycle, I try to obtain the maximum amount of power, performance and style (for lack of a better word) available at a price I'm willing to pay.

Currently I ride a 2007 Suzuki M109-R. It has more power, more performance and better style (subjective, I know) than anything HD offers (other than the Nightrod which is probably on fairly even footing) and for about half the price.

Harley guys seem to hold on to the higher price point as a shield to fend off the inevitable "Uh...dude....that bike MIGHT make 80-90 HP....and it's like 100 pounds overweight" comments. I see it time after time at the Cassoday rally....the Harley goes on the dyno...and the owner slinks off in embarrassment when they give the horsepower and torque output over the PA.

In my opinion, a more appropriate question might be why would anyone ride a HD knowing there are far more capable motorcycles available at much more attractive prices....other than maybe they care less about "riding" and more about "posing?"

the M109 I would barely consider a harleyesque cruiser. (meant as compliment) it is more like VTX and such. they are as you pointed out better. a different breed.
i was refering to bikes like honda shadow, yamaha stars, etc. they are almost direct copies in every way.
BTW my price point was less then a Honda shadow 1100.
Harley's aren't as expensive as they used to be. people just don't always know that yet.
just picked up an 883 sportster for my GF and for the price I paid I could possibly get a 750 Shadow.

08-05-2010, 04:51 PM	#5
Kaneman AMA Supersport Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Odessa, TX Moto: 2000 Honda CBR1100XX Blackbird Posts: 4,931	Harley Davidson Considering Assembly Plant in India by Paul Crowe - "The Kneeslider" on 7/23/2010 in Motorcycle Business Harley Davidson is beginning the next logical step in the international motorcycle market place, announcing they're considering an assembly plant in India. Ever since they first began talking about sales in India, this was, to my mind, a foregone conclusion since tariffs in India double the price of imported bikes. Selling in India means making them there. The company would consider taking that step as Indian sales increase, said Rod Copes, Harley-Davidson's senior vice president of international sales, marketing and business development. Harley also would consider manufacturing motorcycles in other countries for those markets, a step beyond assembling imported parts into completed bikes. ... "Getting the tariff reduced would be ideal. But we have not seen action on that yet," Copes said. With 32 percent of Harley's sales outside of the U.S., figuring out how to best get a firm foothold in other countries will be an ongoing process. I hope their experience doesn't parallel Royal Enfield. They began assembling motorcycles in India back in the mid 1950s, then making parts, then the entire bike. Finally, the British company went under and India is now the only place Royal Enfields are still manufactured. International sales are an important component of any company's long term growth and right now, international sales are rising. If you have to build there to sell there, then you build there. The intention is, as quoted above, "manufacturing motorcycles in other countries for those markets." Will motorcycles built there ever be sent back to the U.S.? It's very common in the auto industry and to think no one inside the Motor Company has ever asked that question or considered it for sometime in the future would be naieve. Harley's strong identity and carefully crafted image as an American motorcycle company, generates some sales on that fact alone for a segment of their market. If you begin building motorcycles in other countries, those sales are put in jeopardy and you now become just another motorcycle company, competing with every other company out there. Then the questions become, "What makes a Harley Davidson better or unique?" Is it style? Quality? Performance? There's no right or wrong here but you can't lean on the American image and build everywhere else. All of the other companies are building in multiple locations and bikes are compared straight up. A Honda isn't given points as a Japanese bike since they are built in other places. Triumph isn't British, either, it's Triumph, for the same reasons. When Harley begins to sever the American manufacturing ties, they enter a new world, and it may be inevitable. How it works for them will be interesting to watch. One further thought: I left out "lifestyle" as what might make Harley unique. Will that translate worldwide when the bikes are built worldwide? Does the lifestyle require a Harley? Things to think about that make you go hmm ... __________________ 1982 Honda XR80 - blown motor, 1993 Kawasaki ZX6D - sold, 2001 Suzuki Bandit 1200S - sold, 1984 Honda Magna - sold, 2001 Kawasaki ZRX1200R - blown motor, 2007 Suzuki DL1000 V-Strom - totalled, 2003 Yamaha FZ1 - sold, 1994 Honda Magna - sold, 2001 Honda CBR600F4i - sold, 1998 Suzuki DR350 - stolen, 1989 Honda Super Magna - sold, 2007 Yamaha Stratoliner, 2000 Honda CBR 1100XX Blackbird

08-05-2010, 05:08 PM	#6
wildchild cruiser Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: on the run Moto: '09 HD superglide, 16 Yamaha FZ 09 Posts: 2,749	actually an interesting thought occurred to me. if HD builds outside of USA and sells here, we all agree their sales in America will basically dry up. so what would happen to sales of Japanese copies of HD. I truly think those would go away as well. most of HD's sales go to people who don't really ride. they enjoy the "image" of a Harley. Yes most of us here with HDs ride them. that's why we are on a motorcycle site to start with. we like to ride. the sales of Japanese cruisers go to guys who want to look like Harley guys without dropping the coin. So would anyone want to ride Japanese cruisers if they weren't trying to look like HD's? I had a Shadow for a year. I wouldn't buy another one for anything. The HD I have now is a much better bike then that. If I weren't on the HD right now I would either be back on a SS or try a BMW for a change. Guzzi is looking interesting as well.

08-05-2010, 05:09 PM	#7
wildchild cruiser Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: on the run Moto: '09 HD superglide, 16 Yamaha FZ 09 Posts: 2,749	BTW here's a newsflash for you, for the last 30 years or so all companies have been going to more automation and less people. it's a growing trend.