War on Drugs: Officially a Failure.

[t-homo]

Even if they did legalize coke and meth, I doubt the percentage of the population that uses them would go up much, if any.

[Avatard]

Temporary spike, followed by a downturn as the black market eroded as profit evaporated, as prices would certainly plummet.

[OneSickPsycho]

Originally Posted by t-homo

Even if they did legalize coke and meth, I doubt the percentage of the population that uses them would go up much, if any.

Coke and meth... I dunno. That's one of the few situations I think it would make them EASIER to get... Access is a big part of the problem... If it's easy, people will try/do it.

I think making the production and importation of the really hard stuff illegal and shifting the 'War' focus on these areas would be much more effective. Instead of spending all the money on shooting dogs and shit, we could invest in REAL education and treatment programs.

Truthfully, I'd rather see them just ignore the shit and save the money, but they ain't gonna stop spendin' anytime soon, at least they could spend it more wisely.

[goof2]

Originally Posted by Kaneman

Fair point, but what about the cost of insuring someone who uses Marijuana on the job vs someone who uses Xanax, Prozac, Adderall, Valium, Hydrocodone or any other prescribed medication that even airline pilots are allowed to take by law, on the job?

Once it is accepted I don't believe it will be viewed differently even in the eyes of insurance companies.

Just an FYI, for pilots the only drug you listed that is allowed is Prozac. From what I understand it is approved only on a case by case basis after consistent monitoring by the pilot's doctor for a year.

With any one of those drugs for people other than pilots the dosage is supposed to be monitored and adjusted by a doctor to minimize or eliminate side effects. For the recreational marijuana users I know the "side effect" is the whole reason they smoke it. As I said, even if it is legalized and someone develops a test to determine if a person is under the influence I still believe it will be treated similar to alcohol rather than prescription drugs.

[Kaneman]

Prozac still has stronger side effects than Marijuana. Now, what about Medically prescribed Marijuana and its effects on the insurance industry? What if insurance realizes that marijuana users are costing them LESS money due to a seriously reduced demand for expensive narcotics?

I think, right off the bat, yea...pot smokers will get screwed....but as the perception changes I think the industry policies will too.

[goof2]

Originally Posted by Kaneman

Prozac still has stronger side effects than Marijuana. Now, what about Medically prescribed Marijuana and its effects on the insurance industry? What if insurance realizes that marijuana users are costing them LESS money due to a seriously reduced demand for expensive narcotics?

I think, right off the bat, yea...pot smokers will get screwed....but as the perception changes I think the industry policies will too.

Prozac can have stronger side effects that marijuana but I would be willing to bet the incidence of those side effects is much more rare from the lawfully prescribed use of Prozac than getting high from marijuana is. That is also part of the reason why prescription drugs are prescription. A doctor is supposed to be monitoring usage and dosage to minimize or eliminate those side effects. The recreational marijuana users I know are looking to achieve the opposite.

[Kaneman]

Originally Posted by goof2

Prozac can have stronger side effects that marijuana but I would be willing to bet the incidence of those side effects is much more rare from the lawfully prescribed use of Prozac than getting high from marijuana is. That is also part of the reason why prescription drugs are prescription. A doctor is supposed to be monitoring usage and dosage to minimize or eliminate those side effects. The recreational marijuana users I know are looking to achieve the opposite.

I would argue that Marijuana users are looking for the exact same effect as Prozac users: a euphoric feeling, an improved mood and a better quality of life. This is, in effect, the exact same effect that recreational or medicinal users of Marijuana are looking to achieve, not the opposite. Being happier or "getting high" is the goal of both substances and the side effects would be something like the munchies for Marijuana vs. death for Prozac.

The reason prescription drugs are able to be prescribed legally is because the average man can not duplicate them therefore they can be patented and a source of billions of dollars in profit. Prozac can be an extremely dangerous synthetic narcotic with numerous dangerous side-effects when administered under a Doctor's care and when used properly. It is not just the abuse of Prozac that causes problems. Lets compare Prozac, a drug that Pilots are legally allowed to use while responsible for the lives of hundreds of people vs. Marijuana, a substance that if used by a pilot during a flight would cause people to literally shit their pants upon hearing the story on the 6'Oclock. Prozac even when fulfilling its requirements under a Dr's supervision is still stronger and more dangerous than Marijuana in that it has a stronger effect on specific functions on the brain itself that THC or CBD as found in pot. This is especially true when considering it on a dosage controlled level, as not everyone who would use Marijuana would sit and smoke a whole joint or take 8 bong rips at a time.

[goof2]

Originally Posted by Kaneman

I would argue that Marijuana users are looking for the exact same effect as Prozac users: a euphoric feeling, an improved mood and a better quality of life. This is, in effect, the exact same effect that recreational or medicinal users of Marijuana are looking to achieve, not the opposite. Being happier or "getting high" is the goal of both substances and the side effects would be something like the munchies for Marijuana vs. death for Prozac.

I wouldn't say it is indicative of all marijuana users but all the people I've been around who use it are looking to get "fucked up". I've been around a few people who used Prozac. They have all been looking to not be disfunctionally depressed. The goals of being glued to the couch high and being functional are not the same thing to me.

Originally Posted by Kaneman

The reason prescription drugs are able to be prescribed legally is because the average man can not duplicate them therefore they can be patented and a source of billions of dollars in profit. Prozac can be an extremely dangerous synthetic narcotic with numerous dangerous side-effects when administered under a Doctor's care and when used properly. It is not just the abuse of Prozac that causes problems. Lets compare Prozac, a drug that Pilots are legally allowed to use while responsible for the lives of hundreds of people vs. Marijuana, a substance that if used by a pilot during a flight would cause people to literally shit their pants upon hearing the story on the 6'Oclock. Prozac even when fulfilling its requirements under a Dr's supervision is still stronger and more dangerous than Marijuana in that it has a stronger effect on specific functions on the brain itself that THC or CBD as found in pot. This is especially true when considering it on a dosage controlled level, as not everyone who would use Marijuana would sit and smoke a whole joint or take 8 bong rips at a time.

The reason prescription drugs are prescription is because they are viewed as beneficial but have the potential to be dangerous. If they can be demonstrated to not be terribly dangerous without medical supervision they are typically made over the counter. Look at some of the allergy medications as an example.

Your analysis ignores the fact that a drug company stands to make more money with an over the counter drug than they can with a prescription drug. Say you make a drug. Would you prefer a potential customer being forced to go to the doctor and get a prescription for your particular medication before being allowed to buy it or allowing the potential customer to take it off a shelf, go to a cashier, and walking out the door with it?

Do you think Tylenol is loosing money because their customers don't need a prescription? I'm guessing you can't make Tylenol in your kitchen. I know I can't. By your logic Tylenol should be fighting to make their drug prescription only. They aren't.

I'll bet Pfizer was pissed when the FDA said Zyrtec could be sold over the counter in 2007 and it became the best selling non food product of 2008 if you believe Wikipedia.

[t-homo]

Originally Posted by goof2

I wouldn't say it is indicative of all marijuana users but all the people I've been around who use it are looking to get "fucked up". I've been around a few people who used Prozac. They have all been looking to not be disfunctionally depressed. The goals of being glued to the couch high and being functional are not the same thing to me.



The reason prescription drugs are prescription is because they are viewed as beneficial but have the potential to be dangerous. If they can be demonstrated to not be terribly dangerous without medical supervision they are typically made over the counter. Look at some of the allergy medications as an example.

Your analysis ignores the fact that a drug company stands to make more money with an over the counter drug than they can with a prescription drug. Say you make a drug. Would you prefer a potential customer being forced to go to the doctor and get a prescription for your particular medication before being allowed to buy it or allowing the potential customer to take it off a shelf, go to a cashier, and walking out the door with it?

Do you think Tylenol is loosing money because their customers don't need a prescription? I'm guessing you can't make Tylenol in your kitchen. I know I can't. By your logic Tylenol should be fighting to make their drug prescription only. They aren't.

I'll bet Pfizer was pissed when the FDA said Zyrtec could be sold over the counter in 2007 and it became the best selling non food product of 2008 if you believe Wikipedia.

How many prescription drugs can you buy a bottle of 100 for $3.50 though?

[Kaneman]

Originally Posted by goof2

I wouldn't say it is indicative of all marijuana users but all the people I've been around who use it are looking to get "fucked up". I've been around a few people who used Prozac. They have all been looking to not be disfunctionally depressed. The goals of being glued to the couch high and being functional are not the same thing to me.



The reason prescription drugs are prescription is because they are viewed as beneficial but have the potential to be dangerous. If they can be demonstrated to not be terribly dangerous without medical supervision they are typically made over the counter. Look at some of the allergy medications as an example.

Your analysis ignores the fact that a drug company stands to make more money with an over the counter drug than they can with a prescription drug. Say you make a drug. Would you prefer a potential customer being forced to go to the doctor and get a prescription for your particular medication before being allowed to buy it or allowing the potential customer to take it off a shelf, go to a cashier, and walking out the door with it?

Do you think Tylenol is loosing money because their customers don't need a prescription? I'm guessing you can't make Tylenol in your kitchen. I know I can't. By your logic Tylenol should be fighting to make their drug prescription only. They aren't.

I'll bet Pfizer was pissed when the FDA said Zyrtec could be sold over the counter in 2007 and it became the best selling non food product of 2008 if you believe Wikipedia.

I should've said pharmaceutical drugs instead of prescription drugs. My point was simply that Pfizer can't compete with naturally occurring substances.