War on Drugs: Officially a Failure.

[Kaneman]

Originally Posted by The Chi

Goof has a point, while it may not be as bad as alcohol, using marijuana in a job situation that requires full function, reason and reflexes would pose a hazard. How would you get around that?

Actually Marijuana simply does not have the same effect on the central nervous system as alcohol. I'm not saying that there is no effect, but Marijuana has been shown repeatedly to have little if any negative effect on muscle memory driven functions, such as driving a car, riding a motorcycle, etc.

Now, there are variables of course. Furthermore, I strongly believe that private business owners should have the right to not hire Marijuana users for whatever reason they want, as private employers. However, I believe once the truth comes out about Cannabis use that few employers will have any incentive to do as such.

[dubbs]

Originally Posted by Smittie61984

Yeah, but I always hear the stoners say "God made weed and Man made beer. Who do you trust?" and crap like that. "nature" also made Cobras and I'm not drinking their shit.

But you have a choice to drink cobra venom right?

If you get caught with cobra venom during a traffic stop you won't go to jail, will you?

[Kaneman]

Originally Posted by dubbs

But you have a choice to drink cobra venom right?

If you get caught with cobra venom during a traffic stop you won't go to jail, will you?

And if you drink it doesn't it make you less likely to die from a Cobra bite? I know there are people immune to Rattlesnake bites...

[the chi]

Originally Posted by dubbs

But you have a choice to drink cobra venom right?

If you get caught with cobra venom during a traffic stop you won't go to jail, will you?

Actually I think you would/could. One of those things you have to have a license for or something.

[dubbs]

Originally Posted by The Chi

Actually I think you would/could. One of those things you have to have a license for or something.

I looked it up quick and didn't see it being illegal, bad example to work with.. many more natural things to pick from.. lol

[the chi]

Useless factoid: Did you know that originally they made anti venom out of chicken blood but it tooks weeks to become viable? Then they tried horse blood since horses are so immune, but that took at least a week and many people are allergic to horse blood so they died anyway, but now theyve found that lambs are immune, and that the anti venom is viable immediately instead of having to wait, AND no one is allergic to lambs blood so once all the medical institutions start using that version (if they havent already) they should be able to save almost everyone (barring those who wait too long, etc.)

[Kaneman]

I saw a show on Discovery, I think it was "I Shouldn't Be Alive" where this kid got bit by a black widow putting his sock on. He had a bad reaction to it and the normally used medicine wasn't working. His step-father heard about this new anti-venom being used by the U.S. Military that came from Mexico, but not approved by the FDA so he couldn't get it.

So, his son was going to die. He got in touch with some folks that knew some folks and flew down to Mexico. He paid $500 for the anti-venom and risked his freedom getting it back to the States. He convinced the Dr. to administer it...and his son went from near death to fine and dandy almost immediately.

Crazy story. What a great father though...he literally went the extra mile.

[the chi]

Thats awesome. Alot of folks do that, leave here for the chance to live. There are proven treatments in places like Mexico that will cure cancer and other ailments, but our govt just wont give them to us (Big Pharm I believe you called it?). I actually knew a guy that went down there for some really bad case of cancer and within a very short time was in complete remission and healthy as a horse.

[Kaneman]

Originally Posted by The Chi

Thats awesome. Alot of folks do that, leave here for the chance to live. There are proven treatments in places like Mexico that will cure cancer and other ailments, but our govt just wont give them to us (Big Pharm I believe you called it?). I actually knew a guy that went down there for some really bad case of cancer and within a very short time was in complete remission and healthy as a horse.

Big Pharm is a genuine and viable threat to our liberty and health for reasons like these. They use their power and greed to slow the advancement of society. I'm not anti-pharmaceutical, I realize that well made narcotics can save lives and improve quality of life. But what they do with that power and money is very scary. They peddle very dangerous mind-altering drugs and are able to successfully convince a large percentage of the population that they should be medicated. They specifically target children and use their influence and power to ensure that millions of American kids go through childhood doped up to a greater extent than the biggest pothead could ever achieve. Adderall is a great example....because its fucking Meth.

So it all sounds crazy, but its not a tin-foil conspiracy. Just turn on the TV and count the number of family oriented commercials promoting the use of potentially lethal narcotics...and then look at all the people in prison and the Trillions of dollars spent for it. Meanwhile, Big Pharm reps, usually with perfect faces and big tits, are wooing local Doctors with expensive dinners, rounds of Golf and free shwag so he'll write more prescriptions, that are again, potentially lethal.

Here's the whole story on that Black Widow thing BTW...

Steamboat Springs — People will go to great lengths to save their kids. Everyone has heard the urban legend about a mother who somehow summons the strength to lift a car off her child trapped beneath.

While Benji Amsden of Steamboat Springs didn’t display any feats of superhuman strength after his 15-year-old son, Mike Makens, was bitten by a black widow spider, Amsden did engage in a weeklong chase straight out of Hollywood — and just as improbable. The film-like saga climaxed with the exchange of money for antivenin in the Mexico City airport.

A black widow spider bit Mike, a Steamboat Springs High School student, on a Monday before school last month. Susie Makens, Mike’s mother, said her son was writhing on the floor in pain within five minutes. A black widow’s venom is a neurotoxin, which destroys nerves or nerve tissue and causes a tremendous amount of pain. The bites are rarely fatal.

While Mike was being treated for pain at Yampa Valley Medical Center, his family was weighing the options for further treatment. The family decided to forgo the use of an antivenin commercially available in the U.S., because of potential side effects and allergic reactions that can be particularly threatening — and potentially fatal — in children.

The family had heard about an alternative antivenin produced in Mexico and used by the U.S. military. Amsden said the side effects are minimal, but the federal Food and Drug Administration has not yet approved a U.S. version of the drug.

A day after the bite, Susie Makens’ brother Jim put the family in touch with Terry Fredeking, an acquaintance and president and CEO of Antibody Systems in Hurst, Texas. Fredeking is self-proclaimed “expeditionary biologist” and has himself been compared to movie characters such as Indiana Jones. Fredeking specializes in obtaining exotic or dangerous substances for pharmaceutical companies. His work has taken him from Mexico, where he collected vampire-bat saliva, to Australia, where he collected parasites from a Tasmanian devil.

In one of many articles written about him, Fredeking proclaims, “If you can pay for it, we can find it.” But when Fredeking learned about Mike’s painful situation, he dropped everything and offered his services for free.

“All of us have a humanitarian backbone; at least I’d like to think we do,” Fredeking said from his Texas lab Thursday. “In this case, it isn’t the type of thing that should be considered monetarily. … I wouldn’t want to take advantage of a situation like that.”

Within hours, Amsden said he and Fredeking had mobilized a whole network trying to locate the Mexican antivenin in the U.S., while also exploring ways to locate the drug in Mexico and legally transport it to the U.S. Amsden contacted people he knew in the military, but that route fizzled out.

“The problem there was being able to explain why two to three vials would be missing,” Amsden said. “Trying to legally get it from military to civilian is impossible.”

From Tucson, Ariz., to Miami, the team contacted organizations researching the drug.

Each lead eventually fizzled out, Amsden said, until Fredeking called him late in the week and told him he had located some vials in Mexico.

“I was almost in tears when he told me that,” Amsden said.

Fredeking and his legal team had also come across a 1980s FDA ruling that they believed would allow the drug to be transported and administered to Mike legally. Fredeking said the law allows for a foreign drug to be transported and administered if it is prescribed by a U.S. doctor, is not a narcotic and is not available in an identical form in the U.S.

Meanwhile, Amsden and Susie Makens had been told by YVMC administrators that they would not allow the Mexican drug to be administered at the hospital due to legal concerns. While upset at the time, Amsden said he understands the hospital’s decision.

“They were obviously in it for the big picture,” Amsden said. “I’m in it to save my kid.”

Amsden said it was up to Mark McCaully, Mike’s doctor, to decide if he wanted to prescribe the drug and administer it to Mike somewhere outside the hospital. A message left at McCaully’s office Thursday was not returned.

Should McCaully refuse, Amsden said he and his wife were prepared to fly Mike to Mexico City in an air ambulance to receive the drug there.

“We both agreed that was our next step if Dr. McCaully wouldn’t do it,” Amsden said.

But after McCaully consulted with malpractice attorneys, Amsden said, he decided to take the risk.

“He took a huge step,” Amsden said. “He was a pioneer for us.”

The antivenin’s manufacturers, Instituto Bioclon, agreed to have a representative meet Amsden in the Mexico City airport with the drug — for only $500. On Saturday, Amsden flew to Mexico City from Denver, through Dallas, to retrieve the drug. The Bioclon representatives, with a sign reading “Mr. Benji,” greeted him in the airport.

Amsden paid for the drug and headed for home. Despite all the necessary paperwork and the FDA’s ruling, Amsden said he was worried about making it back home with the recently purchased antivenin.

“Because I’m down and back in a day, that can be a fishy thing,” Amsden said.

Amsden returned to Steamboat Springs on a Sunday, and that day, Mike received his last doses of morphine and was released from the hospital. In his offsite offices, McCaully injected Mike with two vials of the antivenin.

Amsden said it was amazing to see Mike’s reaction to the drug. The pain that had been torturing him for nearly a week began to leave in 20 minutes, Amsden said, and after less than two hours, Mike walked out of McCaully’s office on his own and went home.

Looking back on the whole ordeal, Amsden said it was “just this side of a miracle” and “kind of like this episode that should be on ‘House.’”

Even Fredeking, the expeditionary biologist, said it was one of his more intense pursuits.

“I wouldn’t want to see anyone in pain like that,” Fredeking said. “This was an immediate threat.”

Fredeking said he normally spends months consulting with attorneys and preparing for his expeditions, while trying to help Mike was “a constant adrenaline strain for five days.”

The experience has inspired Amsden to create a network that will streamline the adventure he went through and help black-widow bite victims, especially children, and their doctors get their hands on the alternative antivenin from Mexico.

“I’m going to set up a network so other kids don’t have to go through this,” Amsden said. “Basically we’re going to set this up so it becomes the nucleus of information for black widow spider bites because they’re so dangerous to kids.”

Fredeking has agreed to help and Amsden said McCaully has agreed to be the network’s point doctor. Bioclon has agreed to make the drug, Aracmyn Plus, available seven days a week. The network will be nonprofit, Amsden said.

Fredeking said he doesn’t expect any trouble from the FDA for one simple reason: “They don’t like bad media.”

[the chi]

Phenominal. And horrific that our own govt wouldnt come off it to save a kids life.