Learning to Ride (Track vs Street)

[Trip]

So I didn't know where to place this, so we will put it in the beginner thread.

So we know the age old argument. The street is no place to learn how to ride for the track, but really how useful is track riding for the street?

We got a thread brewing in my local board about learning to ride well, this is beyond just learning to ride. This is the next step.

I agree, the street is no place to learn to race, even though I treat it that way in the mountains a lot. I believe race schools and track days are the best bet because you can use raceline.

What about the other way around? Is track days more useful than street riding to learn to ride on the street?

This is where I am against track days. Track days don't prepare you for deer, oncoming vehicles, bad road conditions, gravel, and all the various shit that comes with street riding. There is just no replacing that experience to learn to ride well on the street.

So I think track riding for learning street skills is just as useful as street riding for learning track skills. What do ya'll think?

There we go, a good moto thread, now it's up to you bastards to keep it going.

[the chi]

I think track riding is VERY useful in learning good skills for the street. You dont have to worry about the obstacles like animals, cars or bad roads and can focus on getting to know your machine and what it will or wont do with you on the back, proper braking both on pavement and off, and develop consistency in technique.

I think it is also invaluable in learning to avoid obstacles like fellow riders and "surprises" like folks pulling out in front of you, and unplanned for events like someone crashing. You have to react instantly and think ahead to avoid putting yourself in a position you cant get out of safely (like an unsafe pass) and these are great skills for the street.

[tached1000rr]

Originally Posted by the chi

I think track riding is VERY useful in learning good skills for the street. You dont have to worry about the obstacles like animals, cars or bad roads and can focus on getting to know your machine and what it will or wont do with you on the back, proper braking both on pavement and off, and develop consistency in technique.

I think it is also invaluable in learning to avoid obstacles like fellow riders and "surprises" like folks pulling out in front of you, and unplanned for events like someone crashing. You have to react instantly and think ahead to avoid putting yourself in a position you cant get out of safely (like an unsafe pass) and these are great skills for the street.

Good points, and I'll add the track can help with the "lean angle meter" of a meaning help one become comfortable at greater lean angles.

[Trip]

Originally Posted by the chi

I think track riding is VERY useful in learning good skills for the street. You dont have to worry about the obstacles like animals, cars or bad roads and can focus on getting to know your machine and what it will or wont do with you on the back, proper braking both on pavement and off, and develop consistency in technique.

I think it is also invaluable in learning to avoid obstacles like fellow riders and "surprises" like folks pulling out in front of you, and unplanned for events like someone crashing. You have to react instantly and think ahead to avoid putting yourself in a position you cant get out of safely (like an unsafe pass) and these are great skills for the street.

I am not referring to beginners, you already know the basics. That's just it, you aren't getting those surprises on the track, so you don't know how to react to them.

Originally Posted by ontwo

Are we talking about a brand new rider?

no, this is learning to ride well, not learning to ride.

What I am referring to is someone that is using the street to learn how to race. You can't learn to race well on the street, there is just no replacement for track time to learn to race.

Is the same true for street riding? Can you learn to ride well on the street by using track time? Or are you missing out on a major part of your learning by not getting those surprises?

[shmike]

Originally Posted by Trip

Is the same true for street riding? Can you learn to ride well on the street by using track time? Or are you missing out on a major part of your learning by not getting those surprises?

Yes you can but yes you are.

There are still surprises on the track (person in front goes down, blows motor, makes stupid move, etc).

Being comfortable on your bike, knowing not to panic when something is suddenly in your line, knowing that sliding tires don't have to mean a crash, learning to acknowledge an obstacle without fixating on it, being able to brake or change line mid corner are all skill you can learn on the track that will transfer over to the mountains, canyons, etc.*

I agree with tached though that you locals have a leg up. I definitely think it is easier to go from riding aggressively on your local roads to the track than the other way around.

*After thinking about it, most of those skills are learned at the more advanced stages of track riding. Learning them on the street forces you to learn them while still in the early stages of riding.

[Trip]

Originally Posted by shmike

*After thinking about it, most of those skills are learned at the more advanced stages of track riding. Learning them on the street forces you to learn them while still in the early stages of riding.

I agree with this, I had to learn a lot of skills probably a lot sooner than I should have been attempting to learn them just out of necessity.

[shmike]

Originally Posted by Trip

I agree with this, I had to learn a lot of skills probably a lot sooner than I should have been attempting to learn them just out of necessity.

Which in turn makes you a better rider.

If you survive.

[smileyman]

Bike control, bike control,. Bike control. Once you have it, an effective grasp of the maneuvers and technique in automatic muscle memory then all street issues are just a matter of situational awareness.

Track teaches effective movements better as you are presented with the complete range of manuevers several times per lap in a controlled environment that leaves you alone to concentrate 100 pct on technique.

Once you learn to operate at 100 pct, then 60 pct on the street or highway give you alot of spare attention for obstacles, traffic, ect.

[tommymac]

I think it does help street riding. Just learning a race line can help when dealing with corners a bit on the street. it also may help avoid potential problems like high or low sides from poor throttle control.

on the track you can push your bike further and see what some of the limits are so when you ride the street it can make you safer because you know how much you may have in reserve.

many of my friends became "track only" guys, where as, i am one of the few who realy enjoys both. I think for guy slike trip and many of you down south you guys have very good/technical roads in your backyard where as others dont so they wont get as much practice as you guys do.

[ontwo]

Are we talking about a brand new rider?